Upgrading from Reckon Accounts Personal Plus 15 to Personal Plus 16 (Windows 10). Get "Can't validate this file" error.

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Upgrading from Reckon Accounts Personal Plus 15 to Personal Plus 16 (Windows 10). When I do the file validation step following a backup as per instructions I get "Can't validate this file" error.
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Ralph Brown

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Posted 4 years ago

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Ralph

Start with the basics.  If you still haven't uninstalled the PP2015 program, can you open and close the latest PP2015 data file with PP2015?  If so,  can you make a backup from within PP2015 program before attempting the upgrade of the PP2015 PROGRAM to the PP2016 PROGRAM (ie: program, not data).

Meantime, did the BACKUP phase work as part of your first attempt?  IE: can you see evidence of the PP2015 DATA in backup formatted files?

Gary
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Andrew

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Also following on from Garys great advice, if you do have PP2015 installed, open the file and do a validate/rebuild/repair of the data file.

If its not installed, you might need to install it again to get the data file happy before doing the upgrade again.
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Ralph Brown

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Thanks guy's.  I'm still running and using PP2015.  It's working OK, in fact I will now need to do another backup once I can sort out the validate problem.

The backup I did at 8:30 this morning is there ok, on an external HD, my usual backup folder.  I haven't tried to restore the backup though.

I am not going to remove PP2015 until I complete the backup/valuate steps.

How do you do a rebuild/repair, can't see that option in the file menu?

Ralph
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Ralph Brown

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The last time I did a validate would have been in January I think. Ralph
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Andrew

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validate = repair/rebuild. So time to do another one or even a super validate if you're still having issues after he standard validate.

So to validate your file

From the Reckon File menu, choose File Operations, and then choose Validate.
Select the Reckon file which is currently open, and then click OK
Then wait

and if needed how to SUPER Validate your Reckon file.

http://kb.reckon.com.au/issue_view.as...
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Ralph Brown

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It's the regular validate function that doesn't work, see the screen shot attached in my original problem description. 

I have just tried the SUPER Validate option suggested above but get the same result - "Can't validate the file" as per above screen shot.  

Would having recently upgraded to Windows 10 have anything to do with it?
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Andrew

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Rekcon and Windows 10 are NOT FRIENDS at all.... Reckon 80's code base is catching up with them, and everything needs to be ran as a Administrator as Gary pointed out to work on Windows 10.

For a once off test, Right click on RP2015 icon, go run as administrator and try to validate again.

Hopefully this will get you fixed up.
Ralph

With WIN10 in the game, perhaps the process is getting hampered by the need to run everything as administrator,  ie: perhaps the setup.exe  of the PP2016 process needs to be initiated as a right-mouse-click --> RUN AS Administrator..... to have the rights/privileges to deal with the other former data files and programs.

Gary
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Ralph Brown

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Thanks Gary

I haven't got as far as trying to install PP2016.  I have downloaded PP2016 but won't try to install until I can validate my file using PP2015.  My file is over 17meg, would that be a problem?

Ralph
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Ralph Brown

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Thank you Gary and Andrew.

Running in Administrator role solved the problem although getting to change this involved a few different steps to those you suggested.

I came across the article below which explained very well how to set up running the program in admin mode in Win 10.  I have set PP2015 to always start in admin mode and will now proceed to install PP2016.

This link to Cnet article may be of help to others using Win 10.

http://www.cnet.com/au/how-to/always-run-a-program-in-administrator-mode-in-windows-10/#!

Thanks again, a most helpful forum.

Ralph Brown
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Andrew

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Glad you got it sorted.
Ralph

Your comments are terrific, and the more researching into Windows 10 that is undertaken, the more we discover that there are a number of applications out there (not just Reckon products) what are requiring this  'run as administrator'  approach.

Its a big argument as many have mentioned on this forum the curiosity about why after 20 years of Windows,  the use of a user-level program should require administrator level privileges suddenly, (in Win 10).  Consider these quick findings:

http://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/3436-run-administrator-windows-10-a.html
and
http://www.addictivetips.com/windows-tips/stop-windows-10-from-asking-for-admin-rights-to-run-unknow...

are just a couple of quickly found articles that are helping people who use WIndows 10, come to grips with the use of programs OTHER THAN Microsoft Windows Programs (or APPS).

There have been suggestions on this forum that the developers of Reckon should be making their product more suited to Windows 10, to avoid this need to run as administrator.  

SO the question is now slowly emerging about whether this may be some design change in Windows 10 that is outside the control of developers with applications that are NOT 'Windows programs'  as slated in the above example.  

More food for thought.....   With  the above articles now emerging on the internet, perhaps a rethink of the comments in articles like this one, need some review:
https://community.reckon.com/reckon/topics/windows-10-reckon-2015?utm_source=notification&utm_me...

plus an addendum be made to 
https://community.reckon.com/reckon/topics/reckon-accounts-and-windows-10


Cheers

Gary
(not a fan of Win10)
(Edited)
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Andrew

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Well the thorn of Windows has been 90%+ of users are 'Administrators' and could do whatever they wanted. This made it easy for malware and virus to buried deep into the system and hard to remove.

Windows has slowly been increasing the security on each release, making it harder and harder. This shouldn't be a shock to any developer. The issue is, while yes a lot of programs need Administrator to run, a lot also are just poorly written and don't really need it.

RP2015 looks to be one of these, why does a program need Administrator rights to do a validate on the file, when it already has 'full' access to the data file and the program runs happily day 2 day without Administrator rights as Ralph hasn't had any issues. I can't think of anything special the validate will be doing that requires Admin rights?

You hint that Windows 10 is making changes outside the control of developers, yes/no. Windows 10 had a VERY PUBLIC beta period. Reckon had a good 6 months to play with the public betas and make changes. No need to be part of any special programs. This information of the changes has been coming out of Redmond for years now.

The fact is, a lot of these issues with Reckon products had been around in Windows 8.x release as well. Email sending issues and the PDF printer issues in Windows 10 are all hangover issues that had been around since Windows 8 release. Which was released in Oct 2012! So over 3 years ago, but today the issues are still hanging around after a couple of 'version updates' to the Reckon software too.

So yes, you can see why some users (most me) are screaming that Reckon should be making their product more suited to Windows 10 and to avoid this need to run as administrator. Its a legacy issue that is being ignored again. bandaid fixes are not acceptable.

Its a sign of a poorly written program., that is stuck in the 80's. Reckon hasn't had any major rewrites, I would hate to see the code base. It would be a pile of spaghetti pieces patched together by many different people over the decades!

This issue of RA2015 NOT working on Windows 10 was raised months and months before the release of windows 10. Reckon was blind and said it 'works' by their QA testing.

There might be a reason you LOVE Windows 7 Gary more than Windows 8/10. Maybe its cause your Reckon software works on it? Come over to Windows 10 and see how long you last with all these niggling Reckon issues.

Windows 7 was the last version of Windows that Reckon works without any bandaids or pain points. But we can't stay on Windows 7 forever.
Andrew/Ralph,

To decipher the validate issue of Ralphs, I think we need to find out from him, when he did his   WIN10 'recent' upgrade (which has to be after its release of July 29, 2015) and Ralph admits the last time he did a 'validate'' (of PP2015) was last January.   So the process Ralph is trying, is now his first go under Windows 10.   My thinking, is that Ralph has fallen into the Win10 traps here.

I'd be curious to research far more than those two articles I mentioned deeper, as they make mention of UAC requirements differing for APPS and desktop programs, and what the relevance of that is to programs like RECKON.  I've asked Rav in direct email to see if some answer on this point can be provided to assist.  And perhaps the clarity on whether v8.x of WIndows is at all related too, as you point out, Andrew.  

To comment on Win7 Pro 64-bit versus newer versions,  I work in a variety of niche areas.  Autocad, Revit, Cabinetware,  Handisoft, Databuild, and numerous clients who have legacy product needs to run their businesses with a set of products that 'do the job'.   During the 2004 thru 2011 period, many clients stayed on WIn XP Pro SP3  to run their businesses safeguarded with Unix based firewalls to avoid the the need to perpetuallyt upgrade through Vista to early releases of Win7 when their applications were not ready to migrate.   Yes, there are also business cases for staying up with the latest too, and perhaps both answers are right.  It all depends on training, budget, familiarity and business pressures related to uplifting servers and so forth with some of these decisions.   I just happen to work in that segment of engineering, warehousing, production systems, construction industry products,  where WIn7 is doing a reasonable job presently for the combination of products concerned.     

True, that may be totally irrelevant to clients who are running solo Reckon Accounts products,  and so I get back to the query you raise above about whether win8/win10 has any UAC requirements different to Win7.   But in fairness, Andrew,  no, we can't stay on Win7 forever,  but we do need to know what the demands of the replacement are,  and such questions will impact products after July 2015 Win10 release dates, yes?

Should this all be placed in a different "Windows 10 impact" article, separate from Ralph's forum article?  I know there are numerous already,  like  this closed one:
https://community.reckon.com/reckon/topics/reckon-accounts-and-windows-10

Perhaps that needs re-opening and thrashing this out from a Microsoft point of view,  to ascertain whether Reckon is being singled out.

Open minded to all this....

Gary
(Edited)
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Andrew

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Oh these issues are not new to Windows 10.

Widthout digging to deep, here are a couple of examples

https://community.reckon.com/reckon/t...

http://kb.reckon.com.au//issue_view.a...

http://kb.reckon.com.au/issue_view.as...

https://community.reckon.com/reckon/t...

https://community.reckon.com/reckon/t...

https://community.reckon.com/reckon/t...

oh look Windows 8.... and Windows 7 having PDF/emailing issues from way back. Including IE Compatibility view issues, and Online Activation requiring enhanced Protection Mode to be turned off. Say what? Oh right that darn 80's code again! Oh and lots of "Run as Administrator" to get around these issues.

Do these fixes sound familiar to today's fixes for W10?

So no UAC isn't new and has been an issue for Reckon even in Windows 7 days. The problem is each windows release the UAC gets tighter and tighter and that 80's code runs into more and more issues.

Anyhow.... bring on RA2016! High hopes Reckon... High hopes!
Andrew

They'll be surely more than these 6 links,  but they all seem related to the PDF printing issue that arises when multiple version of the PDF converter are present, and need to be distinguished one from the other.  And the Win7 example seems to be related to that in the 2nd and 3rd examples.   Adding printers (be they all PDF converter printers) would surely need administration rights to install and configure.

I'm more focussed on  the need to be running as an administrator, day-to-day well after installation has concluded.  That's the security concern that seems to be underlying a lot of the concern with WIn10,  and as you say, ANdrew, perhaps that same UAC concern was present in Win8.x

Gary
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Andrew

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There are more than 6 examples, as I said above without digging to deep, here are a couple of examples..... I didn't think listing every example would be helpful. Search button up top works wonders if you need more examples!

Agreed Administrator when installing the software is ok.

Administrator for day to day, is not ok.

And yes UAC issues have been around since it was rolled out in Windows 7, way back in 2009. Other companies have been a bit faster at adjusting to the changes and see it as 'poor form' to have a UAC prompt when starting their application, but not Reckon.
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Ralph Brown

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Gary/Andrew,

Interesting discussion for a humble product user.  I upgraded from Win7 to Win10 the day before deciding to upgrade my RA2015 application, must have been Sunday.

Regards,

Ralph